[00:07]	<solomonn>	in linux, sorune can't find my neuros
[00:07]	<solomonn>	it doesn't say anything about where it's looking
[00:08]	<solomonn>	i can load the volume and browse around it OK
[00:14]	<noiz>	where is it mounted?
[00:19]	<solomonn>	n/m... i edited .sorunerc and added the last known location as the mount point
[00:19]	<solomonn>	it's all good now :)
[00:19]	<noiz>	:)
[00:21]	<solomonn>	hrmm
[00:21]	<solomonn>	i went to syncronize and it thinks there's not enough space
[00:21]	<solomonn>	that's pretty odd since i have like 15G of my 40G on there
[00:22]	<solomonn>	hrmm it thinks there's 0 bytes free space
[00:22]	<solomonn>	that isn't cool
[00:24]	<noiz>	so 'df' says you have about 15 gigs free?
[00:24]	<solomonn>	df says i have 13g used and 25g free
[00:24]	<solomonn>	i think i'll just take the free space check out of sorune for now
[00:24]	<solomonn>	hehehe
[00:25]	<solomonn>	hrm, nah, it'll be easier just to make xfersize 0
[00:26]	<noiz>	guilib.pm in gSync check that
[00:26]	<solomonn>	check it?
[00:26]	<solomonn>	i'm not 31337 enough to actually figure out what's wrong with it, i think :)
[00:27]	<noiz>	well, with me, sorune creates space for the database so it wont run out of room
[00:27]	<noiz>	and that made mine say i didnt have enough room when i did
[00:28]	<solomonn>	but the sorune code says it only makes 16M for that
[00:28]	<solomonn>	ooh
[00:28]	<solomonn>	i know what's wrong with it just from checking out the output in the console i ran it from
[00:29]	<solomonn>	my device is mounted on /media/IDW IO D001
[00:29]	<solomonn>	solomon@hurl:~/flac$ ~/downloads/sorune-0.5/bin/sorune
[00:29]	<solomonn>	df: `/media/IDW': No such file or directory
[00:29]	<solomonn>	df: `IO': No such file or directory
[00:29]	<solomonn>	df: `D001': No such file or directory
[00:29]	<solomonn>	it doesn't handle the spaces properly
[00:29]	<solomonn>	cute :)
[00:29]	<solomonn>	i don't know how to fix that
[00:29]	<solomonn>	i am really not 31337 at all
[00:30]	<solomonn>	but who is the author of sorune, i'll tell him next time i see him here :)
[00:30]	<noiz>	maybe try 0.5.1pre3
[00:30]	<solomonn>	where's that?
[00:30]	<noiz>	cuz i think someone had that same problem earlier
[00:30]	<noiz>	development.sorune.com
[00:32]	<noiz>	yeah, someone had a problem like this - loglibrary.com
[00:34]	<solomonn>	hrm
[00:34]	<solomonn>	it wants a newer perl-tk
[00:34]	<solomonn>	than is in debian sid + experimental
[00:34]	<solomonn>	that's a bit whack
[00:35]	<noiz>	yep, i had that problem
[00:35]	<noiz>	you need to get the newest version
[00:37]	<noiz>	as root do 'perl -MCPAN -e shell'
[00:38]	<noiz>	then 'install Tk' at the cpan> prompt
[00:39]	<solomonn>	darn
[00:39]	<solomonn>	i could have just done that instead of removing the check from the old version
[00:39]	<solomonn>	now i will do that :P
[00:40]	<noiz>	and with me, i had to run 'force install Tk' since it would fail 2-3 tests, and then it worked fine
[00:42]	<solomonn>	i guess this will take a while
[00:43]	<noiz>	yeah, it takes a bit
[00:44]	<noiz>	but in case you didnt notice, i changed the main page of sorune.com and i had just announced about the development releases on the main page
[00:45]	<solomonn>	yeah i actually was still going to the yahoo group
[00:45]	<solomonn>	even though if i had though about it i would have remembered sorune.com existing now
[00:46]	<noiz>	:)
[00:47]	<solomonn>	is there a way to get perl-tk to use pretty anti-aliased fonts?
[00:48]	<noiz>	no idea
[00:49]	<solomonn>	yup i get to do force install too
[00:49]	<solomonn>	too bad i didn't have ccache set up as root
[00:55]	<solomonn>	Use of uninitialized value in hash element at guilib.pm line 4623.
[00:55]	<solomonn>	Use of uninitialized value in hash element at guilib.pm line 4622.
[00:55]	<solomonn>	Use of uninitialized value in hash element at guilib.pm line 4623.
[00:55]	<solomonn>	Use of uninitialized value in hash element at guilib.pm line 4622.
[00:56]	<solomonn>	i got a whole bunch of that over and over before it started
[00:56]	<solomonn>	didn't happen before
[00:56]	<solomonn>	not that it's broken
[00:57]	<solomonn>	interesting.. it works, but it still outputs those df error messages
[00:57]	<solomonn>	it just leaves free space as unknown instead of 0
[00:58]	<solomonn>	that's not exactly robust, but at least i can sync now :)
[00:58]	<noiz>	yeah, you should post the problem on the sorune forums and then hopefully darren would be able to give you more advice on how to fix it
[00:59]	<solomonn>	it's possible that i could just put the path in quotes in .sorunerc
[00:59]	<solomonn>	or change the mount point
[00:59]	<solomonn>	but i just let gnome auto-mount it for me so for now i'll let it stay unknown
[00:59]	<solomonn>	i'm not filling my 40G any time soon
[01:00]	<noiz>	yeah, but it would be good for you to post this in the forums anyways, so darren can fix the bug (which i think it would be)
[01:01]	<solomonn>	yeah :)
[01:01]	<solomonn>	but, i hate forums
[01:01]	<solomonn>	what is darren's irc nick?
[01:01]	<solomonn>	:)
[01:01]	<noiz>	sorune
[01:01]	* solomonn  imagines that the spaces may also be why it couldn't find the neuros without manually specifying in .sorunerc
[01:01]	<solomonn>	i'll chat with him about it when he's around :)
[01:02]	<solomonn>	if only you people used mailing lists like a sane software developer :P
[01:02]	<noiz>	why would gnome mount it with spaces?
[01:02]	<solomonn>	i believe it uses the volume ID that HALD gets from the device itself
[01:03]	<noiz>	hmm, i have gnome mount mine auto also, but i guess mine is normal since i have an fstab entry for the neuros too
[01:03]	<solomonn>	that's probably a good idea
[01:03]	<solomonn>	maybe i'll do that sometime
[01:04]	<noiz>	bbl
[01:08]	<DeepB>	what would be a smart place for asking about windows bridging?
[01:09]	<DeepB>	networking, actually, not architecture
[01:19]	<solomonn>	redmond, WA :)
[01:20]	<DeepB>	i've tried, no answer so far
[06:48]	* [Chameleon]  is away: BBIAB
[07:22]	* [Chameleon]  is back (gone 00:34:14)
[14:16]	<gernika>	hey nero -- that was a pretty awesome dialogue you did last week
[14:17]	<nerochiaro>	thanks
[14:18]	<nerochiaro>	is there a way to edit dialogues somehow?
[14:18]	<gernika>	No, but that would be cool wouldn't it.
[14:18]	<gernika>	Like, if they were more wiki-like
[14:19]	<nerochiaro>	no, like if you are the author of one and you can go back and edit things that slipped out, like typos or similar
[14:19]	<gernika>	ah so you would like to retain ownership
[14:20]	<nerochiaro>	yeah, but wiki-like is also fine
[14:20]	<nerochiaro>	just being able to fix mistakes
[14:20]	<gernika>	Looks like I'm going to have to enable user accounts.
[14:21]	<nerochiaro>	if it's a mess, just leave them open for editing to everyone, but with history
[14:21]	<nerochiaro>	or a single kiddie can potentially do great harm
[14:22]	<gernika>	I have already written the code for user accounts -- I just haven't written the code for self-registration
[14:23]	<gernika>	yeah, some stupid kiddie has been deleting all of the dialogue tags >:|
[14:24]	<nerochiaro>	hehe, sooner or later, it was bound to happen
[14:25]	<gernika>	I know. I always try to start out with the assumption of trusting people -- when will I learn?
[14:26]	<nerochiaro>	the assumptions is fine as long as the project is for a niche audience (of non-kiddies). but sooner or later, one will pop up and mess things up
[14:27]	<nerochiaro>	oh, another thing
[14:28]	<nerochiaro>	what about putting a link on timestamps, so that one can click on one and get a log page that starts with that exact timestamp. it's useful to define the boundaries of dialogue sources more easily
[14:31]	<gernika>	Yes. I'd been trying to think how to make that easier -- that would be a very easy thing to implement.
[14:32]	<nerochiaro>	great :)
[14:34]	<gernika>	I enjoy working on the site a lot, but I wish I could fork off the bot programming to someone else. ugh.
[14:34]	<nerochiaro>	the bot is still made in ruby too ?
[14:34]	<gernika>	it is in python.
[14:35]	<nerochiaro>	why so ?
[14:35]	<gernika>	The truth is, I implemented an xml based interface to the database, so anybody could write a bot if I gave them the schema.
[14:36]	<gernika>	There just isn't a lot of ruby libraries for jabber.
[14:36]	<gernika>	*aren't
[14:36]	<gernika>	I have a server written in ruby that accepts tcp connections from the python bot, which just sends xml messages to the ruby server.
[14:36]	<nerochiaro>	that's a good idea
[14:36]	<gernika>	So, concievable, each channel could write their own custom bot.
[14:37]	<nerochiaro>	i forgot that you were logging jabber too
[14:37]	<gernika>	Well, so far I haven't had any interest from jabber users, so technically I'm not :)
[14:38]	<nerochiaro>	but the pain in maintaining the bot comes from what, exactly ?
[14:41]	<gernika>	keeping a bot connected to so many channels and servers simultaneously is difficult with regard to error handling.
[14:41]	<gernika>	Like, I still haven't figured out how to make only the thread for a single channel die rather than the whole bot when there's an exception.
[14:43]	<nerochiaro>	is it a limitation of python ?
[14:45]	<gernika>	I think it's just a limitation of the client I based the bot on.
[14:45]	<gernika>	I think I overshot when I tried to make a single bot that could log BOTH irc and jabber at the same time.
[14:46]	<gernika>	I ended up hacking a python jabber client to become a bot.
[14:46]	<gernika>	so, it's infrastructure wasn't really designed for what I'm using it for.
[14:46]	<nerochiaro>	maybe you should really shoot for rewriting the whole thing, and make something you feel more comfortable with.
[14:47]	<nerochiaro>	you say there are not ruby libraries for jabber no ? time to make one ;)
[14:47]	<gernika>	I think so. Or I could release the python library for interfacing with the ruby xml server and let someone else do it...
[14:47]	<gernika>	hm....
[14:48]	<gernika>	There are some libraries, but they don't handle multi-user conferences.
[14:51]	<nerochiaro>	don't know, i'd say, go for what is more fun to you. for this kind of projects, that's often the best criteria. IMO, of course
[14:51]	<gernika>	absolutely
[14:52]	<nerochiaro>	if the current bot is a chore, drop it
[14:54]	<gernika>	ok -- for all those reading the logs - If you are unsatisfied with loglibrarybot and want to connect your own bot to loglibrary.com -- talk to me
[15:07]	<gernika>	god dammit!!!
[15:07]	<nerochiaro>	we talk about the bot and the bot dies
[15:11]	<gernika>	sorry for repeating this, but it didn't make it into the logs the first time - ok -- for all those reading the logs - If you are unsatisfied with loglibrarybot and want to connect your own bot to loglibrary.com -- talk to me
[16:03]	<unknown_lamer>	Hrm, I bet I could write a script for Bobot++
[16:04]	<gernika>	Bobot?
[16:04]	<unknown_lamer>	The IRC bot I maintain (Written in C++, scriptable with Guile Scheme)
[16:04]	<unknown_lamer>	unknownlamer.org
[16:04]	<gernika>	reading now...
[16:05]	<unknown_lamer>	I really should write the scripting manual
[16:05]	<gernika>	Would you like to see the xml schema?
[16:06]	<unknown_lamer>	XML is evil :-(
[16:06]	<gernika>	I'll take that as a no...
[16:06]	<unknown_lamer>	Which is why Oleg wrote SXML
[16:06]	<unknown_lamer>	(XML->Sexp and back translator)
[16:07]	<unknown_lamer>	email it to clinton at unknownlamer.org
[16:07]	<unknown_lamer>	loglibrarybot should obfusicate email addresses
[16:07]	<gernika>	will do
[16:07]	<gernika>	that's a good point
[16:07]	<gernika>	see, loglibrarybot sucks
[16:07]	<unknown_lamer>	hehe
[16:07]	<unknown_lamer>	Bobot++ can handle tons of channels at once
[16:08]	<unknown_lamer>	This will I will finally write the damn scripting manual
[16:08]	<unknown_lamer>	And release 2.1.7
[16:08]	<gernika>	how about unicode?
[16:09]	<unknown_lamer>	It doesn't support unicode but it doesn't choke on utf-8
[16:09]	<unknown_lamer>	It uses Guile Scheme's regexp interface for running hooks and stuff
[16:10]	<gernika>	Sound very powerful
[16:10]	<unknown_lamer>	Yeah
[16:10]	<unknown_lamer>	The hooks system is kind of described in the manual
[16:10]	<unknown_lamer>	unknownlamer.org
[16:10]	<unknown_lamer>	The bits of the manual that are in place are kind of terrible.
[16:14]	<gernika>	Ok, I sent you the .xsd file.
[16:14]	<unknown_lamer>	And now I must go :-)
[16:14]	<gernika>	Heh, me too. Let me know how it goes
[16:14]	<unknown_lamer>	I'll be back in around 12 hours
[16:15]	<unknown_lamer>	gernika: so is it POSTing the xml to the server?
[16:15]	<unknown_lamer>	gernika: + formats of the data fields like the timestamps
[16:16]	<unknown_lamer>	(it looks really easy to write a log script for Guile with SXML)
[16:16]	<gernika>	Hmm.. that's a good idea :) Actually, this is just a TCP sockets thing right now.
[16:16]	<gernika>	I could make some sort of .wsdl thing though...
[16:16]	<unknown_lamer>	Can you email me some sample XML from loglibrarybot?
[16:16]	<gernika>	that would be way easier for you to implement I bet.
[16:16]	<unknown_lamer>	wsdl>
[16:17]	<unknown_lamer>	?
[16:17]	<gernika>	webservices stuff. Or SOAP.
[16:17]	<unknown_lamer>	Ohhhh that would be TERRIBLE
[16:17]	<unknown_lamer>	So overkil
[16:17]	<unknown_lamer>	l
[16:17]	<unknown_lamer>	because right now it looks like I just have to do something like...
[16:17]	<gernika>	you prefer the tcp?
[16:17]	<unknown_lamer>	TCP works.
[16:17]	<unknown_lamer>	POSTing requires TCP too
[16:17]	<gernika>	ok. I'll send you some XML when I get back.
[16:18]	<unknown_lamer>	And it kind of more of a PITA because I'd have to fix guile-www again
[16:18]	<unknown_lamer>	(the guy who maintains it maintains it against his Guile 1.4 branch instead of official Guile 1.6 ... upporting every time he does stuff sucks)
[16:18]	* unknown_lamer  leaves for real