[00:57]	<JoeyBorn>	crweb, it worked without a glitch!!!!
[00:57]	<crweb>	excellet ;)
[01:36]	<American-Tech>	cool
[03:14]	<daurnimator>	hi
[03:21]	<crweb>	hi
[03:21]	<daurnimator>	whats happening?
[03:22]	<crweb>	Just workin on my gui
[03:22]	<crweb>	almost got the collection manager to a usable state
[03:22]	<crweb>	i'm fighting with "keyboard" input
[03:22]	<crweb>	its actually very hard to do
[03:25]	<daurnimator>	i just spent a whole day shopping
[03:25]	<daurnimator>	got a shit load of clothes
[03:25]	<daurnimator>	batmark: i feel like i could go down brunswick street :p
[05:45]	<crweb>	My music scanner/database portion of the gui is complete.
[05:46]	<crweb>	getting ready to benchmark and see how many files it can scan and how fast.
[05:57]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: why did you say earlier you were fighting with "keyboard" input ?
[05:57]	<crweb>	because "space" is select, not "enter"
[05:58]	<nerochiaro>	what do you mean ?
[05:58]	<crweb>	"enter" takes the default action of the widget
[05:58]	<crweb>	space pushes buttons, selects, etc
[05:58]	<nerochiaro>	ah , i see
[05:58]	<crweb>	it was all a major pain in the ass
[05:58]	<crweb>	then I figured it out
[05:58]	<crweb>	makes sense now
[05:58]	<batmark>	crweb: ur making an alternate ui to osdmain?
[05:59]	<crweb>	now I'm putting all my classes into memory leak testing. Running new/delete in while(1) loops
[05:59]	<crweb>	batmark: oh yes. very much so
[05:59]	<batmark>	with qt right?
[05:59]	<batmark>	that will be awesome!
[05:59]	<crweb>	yes
[05:59]	<batmark>	i will be happy to test if you need anyone
[05:59]	<crweb>	i have pics and avi's up
[06:00]	<batmark>	linky?
[06:00]	<crweb>	www.limesg.com
[06:00]	<crweb>	snapshot2 is the playlist builder
[06:01]	<crweb>	the topiabox video's are the "main screen" while doing testing to see if the OSD is fast enough take input
[06:01]	<crweb>	and the topiaplayer* is the audio player interface (outdated)
[06:02]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: i got Joe a ftpd server today
[06:02]	<batmark>	looking VERY promising
[06:02]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: i think he liked it. You can install on any device
[06:02]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: seen that
[06:02]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: it's just a single binary, right ?
[06:02]	<crweb>	batmark: and the framebufferdemo.asf is a demo of how much the osd can handle with qt4
[06:02]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: what does it share by default ?
[06:02]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: binary, shell script to start, and config file
[06:03]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: /media
[06:03]	<crweb>	if you use the script that is
[06:03]	<nerochiaro>	and it reads the cfg from the same dir where it was stared, i suppose
[06:03]	<crweb>	no, -c configfile
[06:03]	<crweb>	or /etc/bftpd.conf
[06:03]	<nerochiaro>	i see
[06:04]	<crweb>	which is why you should start it with the run-ftpserver.sh i wrote
[06:04]	<batmark>	crweb: is ur ui supposed to replace osdmain or just be an alternative
[06:04]	<crweb>	batmark: im building my own firmware
[06:04]	<batmark>	nice!
[06:05]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: its totally configurable, since you have the config on the rw media also
[06:05]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: i even used it, though I said i never would
[06:05]	<nerochiaro>	well, of course
[06:06]	<nerochiaro>	why did you say so ?
[06:06]	<crweb>	of course, i ftpd the working config using ftpd on the osd
[06:06]	<crweb>	cause I have a card reader
[06:06]	<crweb>	why would i ftp or smb, or anything heh
[06:06]	<crweb>	to a device with no mass storage
[06:07]	<nerochiaro>	yeah, unless you attach an usb hdd
[06:07]	<crweb>	and then its still only 4mbit
[06:07]	<nerochiaro>	oh, right
[06:08]	<crweb>	well..
[06:08]	<crweb>	taglib isn't my memory leak
[06:08]	<crweb>	seems to be qthread maybe
[06:10]	<crweb>	nope..
[06:10]	<crweb>	the thread is good
[06:10]	<crweb>	its my widget that uses the thread :(
[06:12]	<daurnimator>	hey nero
[06:12]	<nerochiaro>	daurnimator: hey
[06:12]	<daurnimator>	sup
[06:13]	<nerochiaro>	chilling out, trying to recover from very problematic last evening+morning
[06:13]	<nerochiaro>	daurnimator: all is ok there ?
[06:14]	<daurnimator>	yeah
[06:14]	<daurnimator>	on holidays
[06:14]	<daurnimator>	doing lots of nothing
[06:14]	<nerochiaro>	lucky you
[06:22]	<daurnimator>	what was your problem yesternight?
[06:23]	<nerochiaro>	arguing bad with girlfriend
[06:24]	<crweb>	huh.. i just found a dryer sheet in the shirt i've been wearing all day
[06:24]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: what's a dryer sheet ?
[06:25]	<crweb>	the pieces of fabric we put in the dryer instead of using fabric softener in the wash
[06:26]	<nerochiaro>	oh, i see. lucky you didn't find it during some important social event
[06:31]	<daurnimator>	anyway
[06:31]	<daurnimator>	anyone got new neuros developments?
[06:32]	<nerochiaro>	still setting up enlightenment, an helping gao with remote input
[06:33]	<crweb>	i'm still trying to workout how to find xp machines without a wins server
[06:33]	<daurnimator>	can someone confrim for me that PAL support is broken in 0.54?
[06:35]	<nerochiaro>	dunno, i don't have a tv, and my monitor seems to accept both pal and ntsc equally good
[06:35]	<batmark>	daurnimator: using tvtime pal is a bit fucked up. but havent actually tried it on the tv
[06:36]	<batmark>	+ ntsc has always worked better for me
[06:36]	<crweb>	pal is always screwy with my stuff
[06:40]	<daurnimator>	well... half the world uses it
[06:40]	<daurnimator>	get compatible
[06:42]	<batmark>	meh most tv's do both anyway. dont they?
[06:42]	<nerochiaro>	modern tvs maybe
[06:42]	<daurnimator>	nope
[06:43]	<daurnimator>	tv cards do both... if software allows
[06:43]	<daurnimator>	but tvs don
[06:43]	<daurnimator>	t
[06:48]	<batmark>	my tv does
[06:59]	<daurnimator>	oh well
[06:59]	<daurnimator>	night all
[06:59]	<daurnimator>	batmark: if you wanna meet up & play with OSD sometime, give me a call
[06:59]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: you any good with make?
[06:59]	<daurnimator>	i'm bored this week :P
[06:59]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: not much, gives me headaches
[07:00]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: i can't figure out where "make ntosd-dm320_defconfig" comes from
[07:00]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: let me take a look
[07:00]	<nerochiaro>	you want to know how that starts a kernel config, or what kernel config file is used ?
[07:04]	<crweb>	yeah
[07:04]	<crweb>	i'm trying to duplicate it
[07:04]	<crweb>	the "basic setup"
[07:04]	<crweb>	all the kernel configs, that are put in by default that arn't in arm/arch/ntosd-configfile
[07:05]	<nerochiaro>	well, i'm not sure how does it do it, but i know it uses kernels/linux/arch/arm/configs/ntosd-dm320_defconfig
[07:05]	<crweb>	yeah, but just copying it to linux/.config isn't good enough
[07:06]	<nerochiaro>	honestly i don't know. what i do to change kernel config is just edit that file (not linux/.config) and then from bsp root invoke make ntosd-dm320_defconfig
[07:07]	<nerochiaro>	how that works inside, is out of my reach at the moment
[07:07]	<crweb>	what they do is first they run defaults that are in neuros-bsp/.config which sets up the base
[07:08]	<crweb>	then they merge in the ntosd-dm320_defconfig in arch/arm to make the full linux/.config
[07:09]	<crweb>	i can't even find a script or any other file containing the text "ntosd-dm320_defconfig" that would lead make to take a specific action
[07:13]	<nerochiaro>	i have 2 theories: 1) maybe it doesn't have a specific command for that, but does one of these implicit actions like the one to go from *.c to *.o ... or 2) it invokes it as part of the kernel config, which uses some other specially tailored makefiles i don't even want to know about
[07:14]	<crweb>	maybe, i'll generate the default configs and just copy them
[07:15]	<crweb>	i'm not using the src-bsp for any other projects than the OSD, i might as well just use the default ntosd config
[07:16]	<crweb>	they only use make ntosd-dm320_defconfig cause they can config for 3 devices
[07:16]	<crweb>	2 of which aren't even compatible anymore
[07:16]	<crweb>	as a possible user of my tree, what say you?
[07:16]	<batmark>	what are the other 2 devices?
[07:17]	<crweb>	ntr3, ntdev-dm320 and ntosd-dm320
[07:17]	<crweb>	the green, the clear, and the black
[07:17]	<batmark>	ahh
[07:20]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: i'll go with just one config. but. there might be more configs later with further dm320 devices
[07:20]	<crweb>	there won't be another dm320
[07:20]	<crweb>	dm345 is coming out
[07:20]	<crweb>	the 320 can't handle anything hidef
[07:22]	<batmark>	345 gonna be open?
[07:22]	<crweb>	sorry, they renamed
[07:22]	<crweb>	DM642C64x
[07:23]	<crweb>	TMS320DM64x
[07:23]	<crweb>	there
[07:23]	<batmark>	lol
[07:23]	<batmark>	time to sleep. nite all
[07:23]	<batmark>	!
[07:23]	<daurnimator>	me too
[07:23]	<daurnimator>	cya
[07:23]	<crweb>	Davinci's
[07:25]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: neuros is still not sure if they will do another dm320 based product or go with davinci for the next stuff
[07:25]	<crweb>	eitherway, the configs aren't going to match up
[07:26]	<crweb>	and it would be easier to add a new config to mine, than to hack it into theirs
[07:26]	<daurnimator>	sorry
[07:26]	<crweb>	plus, figure, they'll hack it in, and I can just generate it, and copy it into mine
[07:26]	<daurnimator>	i'm compelled
[07:26]	<daurnimator>	why not use freescale or simlar
[07:26]	<daurnimator>	something.....standard
[07:26]	<crweb>	daurnimator: you already have a code base
[07:27]	<crweb>	and a growing relationship with Ti
[07:28]	<daurnimator>	something still ARM9 based
[07:28]	<crweb>	you still have to change your code base
[07:29]	<crweb>	you have to modify all your drivers, all your memory settings, etc
[07:29]	<crweb>	picking up a different dsp, would be like moving from ppc -> x86 without gcc
[07:29]	<daurnimator>	but everything is licensed anyway
[07:30]	<crweb>	no, the codecs are closed
[07:30]	<daurnimator>	with something open, we can just use our own codecs etc
[07:30]	<crweb>	thats it
[07:30]	<crweb>	there is way more to the system than just codecs
[07:30]	<crweb>	usb, sd, cf, usb, etc. is all in the code base, and already done
[07:31]	<crweb>	codecs are the largest piece of software for the consumer, but the smallest for the system/developer
[07:32]	<crweb>	they would have to throw away or heavily modify nmsd, cooler, osdmain
[07:32]	<crweb>	everything that uses the codecs
[07:32]	<crweb>	cause the new ones will be a different api
[07:32]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: was out to get some food. i agree with using just one config file
[07:32]	<daurnimator>	sigh
[07:32]	<daurnimator>	i just wish we used something like the imx31
[07:32]	<daurnimator>	www.freescale.com
[07:33]	<crweb>	we do
[07:35]	<crweb>	an arm11 would be nice though
[07:36]	<crweb>	1136 i mean
[07:38]	<daurnimator>	i'm half tempted to go off on my own and invest money in my own device :P
[07:38]	<nerochiaro>	daurnimator: money that you don't have to even buy a new power supply unit...
[07:39]	<daurnimator>	ha. well, i do have a heck of alot of money in bonds & trusts
[07:39]	<daurnimator>	just it takes about 3months notice to access
[07:39]	<crweb>	i'm looking at a gumstick unit right now
[07:40]	<daurnimator>	and has about $1000 fees on each withdrawal
[07:41]	<crweb>	www.gumstix.com
[07:41]	<daurnimator>	only gets used for MAJOR purchases & business transactions
[07:41]	<daurnimator>	eg, buying a car/house/college fees
[07:41]	<crweb>	i wish they had vga
[07:42]	<crweb>	but, you can get bluetooth for keyboards and stuff
[07:42]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: you have to build a case yourself for these
[07:42]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: they have them
[07:43]	<crweb>	gumstix.com
[07:43]	<crweb>	see what i meant. I was goig to get that
[07:43]	<crweb>	then I saw the osd for $229
[07:43]	<crweb>	and the osd plays divx/xvid to a tv
[07:43]	<nerochiaro>	heh, both are bool
[07:43]	<nerochiaro>	cool
[07:44]	<crweb>	bluetooth would be nice though
[07:44]	* daurnimator  wonders: how much to start your own company, hiring an asian factory...
[07:44]	<nerochiaro>	can't get bt dongles ?
[07:44]	<crweb>	for the osd?
[07:45]	<nerochiaro>	daurnimator: ask Joe he surely will be able to tell you
[07:45]	<nerochiaro>	crweb: yeah
[07:45]	<crweb>	i guess we could
[07:45]	<crweb>	we'd have to implement that part of the usb driver though
[07:45]	<daurnimator>	i bet that if you did it right, making everything an open affair
[07:45]	<daurnimator>	nothing closed
[07:45]	<crweb>	daurnimator: its not that easy
[07:45]	<daurnimator>	you would get alot of support
[07:45]	<crweb>	only after you have a working product
[07:46]	<daurnimator>	thing is
[07:46]	<daurnimator>	it'd have to be proitable very soon
[07:46]	<daurnimator>	i don't have to do it :P
[07:47]	<crweb>	i'm going to have to rebuild my xconfig to not use xinerama, and just use twinview's xinerama extensions
[07:47]	<crweb>	my x is way to slow
[07:47]	<daurnimator>	theres enough money involved for most of my life
[07:47]	<crweb>	have fun with tha
[07:47]	<crweb>	t
[07:47]	<crweb>	meanwhile..
[07:47]	* crweb  oogles at the gumstix
[07:48]	<nerochiaro>	daurnimator: dream on
[07:48]	<daurnimator>	heh
[07:48]	<daurnimator>	or i could just buy shares in neuros
[07:48]	<daurnimator>	and sway the company as desired ;)
[07:48]	<crweb>	i really want to get hired by an embedded company this summer
[07:48]	<crweb>	after i graduate
[07:49]	<nerochiaro>	daurnimator: you can't. it's not public
[07:49]	<daurnimator>	i thought joe said he had shareholders :S
[07:49]	<crweb>	private share holders
[07:49]	<crweb>	you'd have to offer him quite a bit of $ to make a difference
[07:50]	<crweb>	if you aren't a viable investment income, you aren't worth the hassle
[07:51]	<daurnimator>	i know
[07:51]	<daurnimator>	and, my family can probably sort out the money to make more profit than i can
[07:51]	<daurnimator>	just.. i just have such an interest in the future of the portable devices market
[07:54]	* daurnimator  goes off to father for business advise and money
[07:55]	* nerochiaro  gos off to kitchen for tea
[07:56]	* daurnimator  goes off to sleep
[07:56]	<daurnimator>	why do i always give in to breakfast meetings
[07:56]	<daurnimator>	:(
[08:09]	<crweb>	I'll brb, time to restart with new xinerama/twinview speeds :)
[08:13]	<crweb>	much better indeed
[08:13]	<crweb>	4 displays on software based xinerama just wasn't cutting it
[08:25]	<crweb>	all this time my lcd's have been running at 75Hz instead of 60
[08:25]	<crweb>	now they are super clear
[08:26]	<nerochiaro>	refresh rate shouln't matter much for lcd's
[08:26]	<nerochiaro>	?
[08:26]	<crweb>	vertical does, It makes stuff fuzzy
[08:27]	<crweb>	usually they are locked
[08:27]	<crweb>	but I have a multi sync
[08:27]	<crweb>	it will do +-15Hz from 60Hz
[08:28]	<crweb>	and it will warn you in the menu's, "Your optimal resolution is 1280x1024@60 you are running at 1280x1024@75"
[08:28]	<crweb>	i just haddn't been in the menu in a while heh
[08:29]	<nerochiaro>	your eyes thank you
[08:29]	<crweb>	yeah, i was starting to think I need stronger glasses
[08:35]	<nerochiaro>	anyone about with knowledge of linux tty ?
[08:35]	<crweb>	what kind of knowledge?
[08:36]	<nerochiaro>	what is supposed to come out of /dev/tty (for example if you cat it)
[08:36]	<nerochiaro>	?
[08:36]	<crweb>	oh, garbage
[08:36]	<nerochiaro>	garbage ?
[08:37]	<crweb>	k
[08:37]	<crweb>	well, it will catch your keypresses
[08:37]	<crweb>	but also, it will constantly output \n
[08:37]	<crweb>	or \0
[08:37]	<crweb>	not really sure which maybe even \0\n\r
[08:38]	<crweb>	its ascii though
[08:38]	<crweb>	or int
[08:38]	<nerochiaro>	ok, fine
[08:38]	<crweb>	or whatever you want it to be.
[08:38]	<crweb>	or cast it to be
[08:39]	<crweb>	i think cat treats it as char
[08:39]	<nerochiaro>	now, the other question... how does one send stuff to it ?
[08:40]	<crweb>	thats kernel side
[08:40]	<nerochiaro>	yeah, kernel side
[08:40]	<crweb>	you config your driver to attach to one of the /dev/tty* nodes
[08:40]	<crweb>	and your driver outputs
[08:41]	<nerochiaro>	outputs how ?
[08:41]	<crweb>	just like you did with your ir-keyboard emulate
[08:42]	<crweb>	ok
[08:42]	<crweb>	well, maybe not.
[08:42]	<crweb>	you do it like uinput does it
[08:43]	<nerochiaro>	looking in there
[08:43]	<crweb>	tldp.org
[08:44]	<crweb>	www.linuxjournal.com
[08:44]	<nerochiaro>	nope, that's if i want to create a new char device. i don't. i just want to use /dev/tty
[08:44]	<crweb>	you just hook to it using the tty interface
[08:44]	<nerochiaro>	ah, that last one looks promising. reading it
[08:45]	<crweb>	that book i have used this article as a reference
[08:45]	<nerochiaro>	eh ?
[08:45]	<crweb>	the writing 2.6 kernel drivers book
[08:45]	<crweb>	i always jump to
[08:45]	<nerochiaro>	ok
[08:45]	<crweb>	has this article in the references
[08:46]	<crweb>	err, that article above
[08:46]	<crweb>	ftp.ssc.com
[08:46]	<crweb>	and exacmpe tty driver for 2.4
[08:46]	<crweb>	example
[08:53]	<crweb>	nerochiaro: you want this uImage/rootfs.bz2 combo?
[08:53]	<nerochiaro>	with what inside ?
[08:54]	<crweb>	it is 3.27-0.54
[08:54]	<nerochiaro>	are you referring to the discussion in the mailing list ?
[08:54]	<crweb>	official build
[08:55]	<nerochiaro>	well anyway, i don't really need it now, although in general it's a good thing to have for every release
[08:55]	<crweb>	i dunno if we'll get anotherone
[08:56]	<nerochiaro>	why not ?
[08:56]	<crweb>	it was like breaking teeth to get this one
[08:57]	<nerochiaro>	i don't understand why they won't just put them out next time too
[08:57]	<nerochiaro>	it doesn't cost anything
[08:57]	<crweb>	they are stuck on the why
[08:58]	<nerochiaro>	even gao ?
[08:58]	<crweb>	no
[08:58]	<crweb>	the underlings
[08:58]	<nerochiaro>	well, it's gao who counts anyway
[08:58]	<crweb>	he'll tell them and then they grill about why till they finally give in
[08:59]	<crweb>	but, I had to specifically ask gao for this one
[08:59]	<crweb>	took 2 days to get
[08:59]	<nerochiaro>	oh well, i think disassembling the upk ourselves ain't that hard. or we can build them and upload them ourselves somewhere
[08:59]	<crweb>	to even download, cause the guy hosted it on a internal china server
[09:00]	<crweb>	it is very nice to have though
[09:00]	<crweb>	instant nfs booting with a unlimited rw fs
[09:01]	<nerochiaro>	i know, but if it means fighting to get it everytime, it's just less hassle to have one build it and then everyone else use it
[09:01]	<crweb>	i don't understand what the hassle could possibly be
[09:01]	<crweb>	they put the rootfs and the uImage IN the upk
[09:03]	<nerochiaro>	it's useless to ask these questions, and you know it. i don't like trying to convince a wall to move, unless there's not way to get around it.
[09:03]	<crweb>	heh
[09:04]	<crweb>	well, i am actually a psychologist/sociologist.. I have a lot of interest in why people are x.
[09:04]	<crweb>	heh
[09:04]	<nerochiaro>	or maybe gao will up them himself. you said he was convinced, no ?
[09:04]	<crweb>	I dunno if he was for the always, but he didn't say no
[09:05]	<nerochiaro>	anyway, don't get me wrong. i am interested too in why they think that way, but trying to understanding someone is a separatae thing from trying to convince someone.
[09:06]	<nerochiaro>	and to hell my bad english
[09:06]	<crweb>	i'd never know you weren't english
[09:07]	<crweb>	though, the fact you say too instead of also is a key indicator
[09:07]	<crweb>	don't stop, too is correct. the US just can't speak its own language
[09:08]	<nerochiaro>	really ? i always thought "too" and "also" could be used almost interchangeably
[09:08]	<nerochiaro>	almost
[09:08]	<crweb>	i am interested too
[09:08]	<crweb>	i am also interested
[09:08]	<crweb>	not, i am interested also
[09:09]	<nerochiaro>	oh, yeah. i get it. it's all a matter of position in the sentence. right
[09:09]	<crweb>	and not, You own quake 2, I own quake 2 too
[09:09]	* nerochiaro  has flashbacks from english classes ages ago ;)
[09:10]	<crweb>	i die a little inside everytime someone says 2 too
[09:11]	<crweb>	i was raised by city folk, living on a farm, in a farming community.
[09:11]	<nerochiaro>	so bad english all around you, i guess ?
[09:11]	<crweb>	oh yes
[09:11]	<crweb>	its southern english, without the accent
[09:12]	<nerochiaro>	you mean southern american ?
[09:12]	<crweb>	yes
[09:12]	<crweb>	ever heard of Jeff Foxworthy?
[09:13]	<nerochiaro>	no, but i know how it sounds. i have an hard time understanding southerner characters in movies and tv shows
[09:13]	<crweb>	me too
[09:14]	<crweb>	though most of the time movies and tv shows is fake southern
[09:14]	<crweb>	they do it just enough to let you know the location is southern
[09:14]	<nerochiaro>	well, i don't even want to hear the true one, then ;)
[09:15]	<nerochiaro>	but i guess the thousands of accents we have for italian here in italy are puzzling in the same way to a foreigner
[09:16]	<crweb>	from what I understand, english is one of the least complex, simplisted to understand, and hardest to say what you mean in.
[09:16]	<crweb>